What did Chris Watts HATE about Shan’ann?

What did he hate the most about her? What did she hate most about him? What this question really addresses is not only the family dynamics, or the interpersonal dynamics between the husband and the wife in their marriage, but also just two individuals living under the same roof. What was Chris Watts like to live with? What was Shan’ann like – as a person?

What are the things that generally agitate people in a marriage, after a length of time together? What things would have specifically chafed at these two particular personalities?

To adequately answer these questions we have to know more about who Chris Watts is and was. Fortunately we get to have a little peek into that area thanks to Ashleigh Banfield’s recent interview with Richard Hodges, a former roommate and college classmate of Chris Watts.

Take a look.

On the surface, and bearing in mind Hodges last made contact with Watts in 2005, there’s an impression of a hard working kid who is also very hard on himself. He’s trying hard and working hard to elevate himself into some significance. He’s trying to become someone.

Skip to ten years later and Chris Watts is in Colorado in a picture-perfect house, with a picture-perfect wife and picture-perfect family. One has the impression this is what he always wanted – the picture-perfect side of things. This is significance. He’d spent a good fifteen years building himself up, and for that matter, so had Shan’ann. Both of them came from humble beginnings and both worked their asses off to build what they had by August 2018.

So if they had so much in common, what did Shan’ann do “wrong” in Chris Watts’ eyes?

Let’s examine that through 3 prisms. Firstly, the Scott Peterson case. Secondly, the particular circumstances of the Watts case. And thirdly, through my personal experience with someone involved in MLM.

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A. What did Chris Watts Scott Peterson HATE about Shan’ann Laci?

Like Shan’ann, Laci also saw Scott as a sort of trophy. She hero-worshiped him in public. She idolized him. Scott was part of her idea of a fairy tale. It’s not clear that that was the case so much behind closed doors.

If Scott murdered Laci, then clearly what was happening was the desire to believe in something that wasn’t true overpowering the reality. In other words, Laci was more in love with the idea of being in love, than with the actual person. The same was true with Shan’ann and Chris, wasn’t it?

And this idea is mirrored in the fantastic amount of fairy tale but ultimately fake happy snaps associated with the Watts case.

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B.  The circumstances of the Watts case

Chris was dedicated to what he was doing, so was Shan’ann. Chris was working hard. Shan’ann was working hard. So what was the thing wedging its way between them?

In my opinion it was primarily two things. Shan’ann was suffering from a serious auto-immune disease, and this made her into a particular kind of person with a particular psychology. Although it manifested in some ways positively [wanting to better herself, developing a fighting spirit], she may have overcompensated in the sense of becoming a perfectionist and a control freak. Managing her anxiety about her health ended up becoming managing her world, and everyone in it.

In the oft played clip where she tells Celeste in a singsong voice to say “hi” to the camera, when Celeste doesn’t, Shan’ann barks at her: “Say hi!”. How often was that merciless tone used behind closed doors, when the camera was off? Because it’s a tone that brooks no truck with dissent. It’s my way or the highway.

In Two Face I explore this aspect in a lot more detail, using another example from her social media to reinforce this impression of an always-on pushy, controlling, oppressive person.

There is definitely something more to this, because even her colleague, Nickole Atkinson, describes Shan’ann as OCD. Her scheduling alone describes a very anal attitude to time management, a key trait of the perfectionist, and OCD. Some folks on the Websleuths forum have also picked up on the same thing. Chris Watts may have put up with this throughout their six-year marriage, and all things being equal, he may have taken it on the chin, and on both cheeks. But all things weren’t equal, and they weren’t equal in a very key, and very crucial sense.

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C.  My personal experience with someone involved in MLM

We can’t prove – at this point – that Shan’ann wasn’t making the sort of money she claimed she was making. Until we have access to the forensic files and financial data, we have to resort to some extent to speculation. What we do know is that as recently as 2015 the couple were bankrupt. We also know that their money troubles were still with them in August 2018 – they had a date in court with the local homeowners association which proves this. So even without delving into the debits and credits, we know the Watts finances for reasons unknown were fucked.

What were those reasons? Was it because a third kid was on the way? The finances were already fucked before that happened. Was it because Chris Watts was spending the money, or not bringing the money in? We see that he was in a stable if relatively low paying job, but he was reliable and hard working, and doing double time for Shan’ann in her job.

It’s her job, see, that’s the unknown factor. One way to decipher this aspect is to personalize it. What does it feel like to live with someone who is a multi-level marketing [MLM] type? What are their finances really like?

Below, in italics, I’ve provided a brief anecdote of my experience. This isn’t to indulge you, or myself, but as a way to better understand what Chris Watts may have despised, even hated, about Shan’ann. Before you begin reading, just be aware that this isn’t about transference. Whatever my feelings about MLM or yours, all this is is my experience with a particular person. It may or may not provide insight into this case, and it may shed more light on the unknowns that went on behind closed doors.

Harriet – let’s call her Harriet – lived in a big, beautiful double-story house in a posh suburb. She was a young, single mom. Pretty. Blonde. Blue-eyed. The house wasn’t hers. It belonged to her wealthy parents. Harriet was involved in AMWAY and Herbalife. Sometimes packages would arrive, and if Harriet wasn’t around, I’d sign for them. It was invariably AMWAY shit, sent by courier. I often heard her telling people  AMWAY’s “not a pyramid scheme”.

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I also often heard her rationalising about how great MLM was because once you’ve done the initial work you don’t need to do anything any more, other people work for you. She didn’t seem to recognize that that’s what everyone else was planning on too. If people allow themselves to be recruited [for a fee], and all the recruits rely on the fact that other recruits will do their work for them, who actually works? Who actually makes money? The only real money comes from the way the cumulative memberships and profits from product sales are distributed from those at the bottom to those at the top of the pyramid.

Although Harriet called the AMWAY MLM “her business” or “the business” over the course of five years she very seldom worked. I don’t know how much money she made from AMWAY but I do know she never had any money, and that her parents were always giving her money, and buying her things.  Often this money was given to her as part of an agreement or incentive to do something. She’d take the money but they never got her to execute on her end of the bargain. At one point when I was there they even bought her a brand new car as a gesture of faith. She took the car but later fell out of the arrangement they made.

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Occasionally, when her parents grew desperate and threatened her, there were spurts of activity. She’d have a few meetings at home or she’d travel off to AMWAY’s motivational workshops. Each time she’d arrive back from these workshops inspired, pumped up and ready to get to work. Harriet was someone who often overstated things, often exaggerated.

Harriet had friends but they were weird. While she saw herself as upper class, none of her friends were. One long-term boyfriend was about 15 years younger than her, whom she asked me to keep secret from her parents. The next was about 15 years older, who worked in a junk yard. Many of her female friends were over-the-hill housewives, almost all overweight, uneducated and ragged in some way. Since I’d known Harriet through a prior circle of mutual friends, now it was clear that virtually all those solid middle class friendships had fallen away. Had she pushed the MLM stuff onto them until they shut the door? I know she tried several times to recruit me but instead of buying into it or rejecting it, I simply said “I’ll think about it” even though I’d made up my mind.

What started annoying me over time was how hard I was working and her constant and very apparent laziness. And her inclination to complain about small things. I wasn’t the only one aggravated by this. Her parents, who often loaned her money, increasingly demanded that she find a real job. All told, in the five years I lived there she worked less than a total of six months in real jobs, and for the rest, told people she had her own MLM business. 

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Harriet’s finances weren’t my concern as a lodger, but what got extremely irritating was because she didn’t work, she had to find something to do. Since she was home all day, she soon began to worry and complain endlessly about whether I was dirtying her furniture by sitting on them, or dirtying the carpets by walking on them. She was pedantic about cleanliness. Her kitchen and lounge had those gadgets that puffs out toilet spray every few seconds. The carpets were repeatedly dry-cleaned, the house repeatedly painted. Everything was constantly being washed and cleaned.

Sometimes she’d arrive home with bags of shit-smelling compost, which would make the entire house smell of guano. Landscape designers would arrive every so often to deal with her garden.  The pets in the house began to gravitate towards me, because I paid attention to them.

In the end I placed sheets and towels over the furniture and carpets I used upstairs so that my filthiness wouldn’t disturb her. And so on and so forth. Harriet’s MLM didn’t bother me, but it didn’t endear her to me either. I simply thought of her as extremely high maintenance, a self-centered alien species that had lost her mind. I put up with her OCD, no matter how unreasonable it was, because while I lived there, I had to. So I did with minimum fuss.

I wasn’t married to her and I was never her boyfriend, but the OCD was a symptom of a larger malaise. Had I been involved with her, the MLM would have been the first to go.

All that is a very long way of saying something very simple. Someone with OCD is tolerable when they’re holding up the fort, and when there’s a fort that you also have a stake in. But it’s intolerable when they aren’t holding up the fort and you are, or when they’re ruining your stake in your own home.

There definitely is a certain point, an inflection point, when that happens. Everybody knows in a domestic situation that moment when they decide, irrevocably, they’re done. Some people tell those they share their living spaces about their change of heart, but that only makes everything worse. You’re wiser if you don’t, but then, for as long as you continue living there, you feel like you’re pulling on the short end of the straw.

I know I reached that point with Harriet and her junkyard boyfriend. A few months before I left, I felt I’d had enough of their bullshit. Obviously I didn’t tell her this, I simply started preparing myself and my affairs to move out. I spent less and less time at home and tried to manage things so that I never encountered either of them, even in passing. I was just trying to avoid communicating and thus confronting. So I was living with the enemy but eager not to be. I didn’t let on that I was pissed off about anything.

The exit, when it happened, wasn’t pretty. There were no dead bodies, and no one was strangled, but there was some anger, shouting and unhappiness. I won’t go into the details but it wasn’t pleasant.

I suspect that like Harriet, Shan’ann wasn’t actually pulling in 80K a year. Either the money wasn’t coming in, or it wasn’t coming in consistently. What happened to her mandatory Live videos in August? And if she was still bringing in the money, why didn’t they have any money? Why were they an ongoing foreclosure risk?

If it was Shan’ann’s fault that they were losing their home because she wasn’t holding up her end of the deal, because of the MLM hocus pocus bull crap, then Shan’ann’s OCD and cheery Facebook mindfuckery had to have become harder and harder to live with. Then, with the announcement in May of a third child on the way, Chris Watts had a serious sense of humor failure.

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Two Face is available right now on Amazon.com

87 thoughts on “What did Chris Watts HATE about Shan’ann?

  1. Yes, yes yes. I’ve said enough on the MLM subject – but to go back to your previous page, item #1 stands out exceptionally, but also on this page the former roommate and buddy says what we all suspected about young Watts is that he was a sincere, earnest, hard working young man. aka, normal. But to think in any way that he was not complicit in what took place, is to miss a point here. He wanted all of those things that Sha’nann pretended they had and could have. The big beautiful house, order, impeccable taste, a family, the fairy tale. But where was she putting all of her attention – on the company. He was shut out, except as prop. He was very lonely I believe. He tried to fix it by having affairs or affair, but he had to go back to it every night. There was alot of sound and fury in his household, but it signified nothing. In fact, it signified no money.


    • I always wonder why someone who fancies themselves a writer cannot come up with vocabulary above that of a pubescent teenager. Vulgarity is not a descriptive use of language. It is simply the failings of an adult mind. Your grasp of an MLM seems one-sided also. I see that you are working to connect personality types but, again your grasp on personality types seems limited in both understanding and description. But then again, there is always a vast audience of viewers and readers that do not need the entertainment to reach much higher than Saturday morning Scooby-Doo. At leat you have achieved that.


  2. Part 2 of this story will be interesting. For all intents and purposes, and as Jen pointed out previously, Watts has been on suicide watch. It might be a plea for sympathy leaked to the media by the defense, but from what I read he has been sleeping all day, with no access to reading materials, television, or conversation with other inmates. Guards or deputies check on him every 10-15 minutes. HOWEVER, he appears to be rallying. 9/17 he filed a motion to deny the prosecution buccal swabs, finger and palmprints standing on his 4th amendment constitutional rights. You can find the motion online. I imagine his attorneys have advised him that the state could go for the death penalty, so he needs to snap out of his depression and get to work. By the time November rolls around I suspect will see the other face of Two Face.


    • I do agree she destroyed him, I have seen text messages from her and her friends and they all had the same mentality as she had and they were all planning on moving into the house with her and Chris and pushing him out but keeping the house and his checks by way of alimony and child support payments,they were a clic that was going out their way to belittle him humiliate him.she had the kids doing it too


      • Having his kids mimic and mock him is sooooo bad. She took them to a very expensive day care early in the a.m. They had strictly scheduled naps and had a 7:00 bedtime. He spent more quality time with them than she did on the weekends. I wouldn’t want to live there!!!


  3. Second blog I have read This is the second blog I have read from this site that had analyzed Shan’ann. I know we don’t have much on Chris but man, he is getting let off way too easy with you people. I don’t partake in MLM or the products that MLM tries to sell to potential customers, I have had many friends involved in beach body/monat/pruvit and although it’s certainly not my cup of tea, these people are not piece of sh!t either. One of my closer friends who is VERY involved in beach body had made quite a bit of money. Enough where she was able to live in Costa Rica with her husband and their 4 daughters for 6 months. Her husband, a carpenter and her a partner with beach body. Both also live in a 400K house in one of the nicest neighborhoods near the city of Pgh. This guy that you have in this blog that knows Chris that had last spoken to him almost a decade ago as a reference of who Chris is, A LOT can change over 10 years so to use him as some sort of proof that Chris is normal is quite weak imo. Why no speculation on his spending habits? Why no indepth thoughts on who Chris was with what you have? Why is Shan’ann the one who is set out to be the perp always in these types of blogs? Nothing, not one damn thing, is normal about stuffing the dead bodies of your children into oil tanks in an attempt to dispose of them. So try harder.

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    • When Shakedown did a series of books on Jodi Arias, no one wanted to look at Travis other than as an innocent victim, and no one wanted to look at Jodi other than as a lying monster. This was the mainstream media narrative, and most of the blockbusters took that line. Shakedown didn’t. We said – let’s look at both people from both sides and just try to figure out what happened. Let’s just see what the evidence and their own accounts say. So that’s what we did, and it became a 6 book series.

      By the time some of our readers reached the final books – Obscenity and Obscurity – they felt they’d almost gone through a life changing experience. That’s the sort of impact we want our books to have. It’s not about shouting guilty the loudest, it’s about figuring out how we work as people through these crimes.

      Agree Linn, a lot can change in 10 years, but identity is foundational, and identity is the key reason why people are who they are and why they do what they do. Many if not most crimes occur because of a perceived threat to one’s identity, especially one’s social identity.

      Why no in-depth thoughts about Chris Watts? Shucks, I wrote a book about it that’s way more in-depth than these blogs. Try reading it if you’re not finding satisfaction here. It’s 30 000 words long; each of these blogs is less than 1000.

      There was a series of blogs on lie spotting, then there were blogs about his background, a 2012 speech he gave and his sex life.

      Here are a few:










      We’re trying to look at this case from all angles. If you’d prefer to focus only on hating Chris, there are plenty of blogs and forums that do that, and only do that. The media is also a great resource. Trying to understand what happened means looking at both parties. It’s not a matter of blaming or judging anyone, which is why I also provided my personal experience.


      • Completely agree Nick. You’ve written as much as possible on Chris, considering there’s not a lot to go on. You have scrutinised both as much as possible. Linn, maybe buy his book or read his blog entries. The guy in the blog is someone invited by Ashley Banfield not by this blogger & writer. Also noticed that the room-mate says he’s also been talking to all the other old friends and everyone is on the same page. If I was looking for evidence of a psycho, I’d be looking for evidence from over 15 years ago through to today so it’s very valid. To be honest Linn you sound more upset by the MLM criticism. Certainly noticed a lot of MLMers all over social media weighing in on this case


      • Never ever a reason for murder. Chris could’ve & should’ve walked away. Let the courts get him access to his girls. I agree that Shan’ann could have been a difficult, problematic person but there’s nothing about that means murder is ergo the choice.
        Unless she was hurting those girls or trying to physically hurt or kill them and him, he did wrong. He belongs where he is.


    • This whole facade she created is beyond bizarre. I don’t find her to be a genuine person in the least. What this man did is despicable but we are just trying to make sense of it all. These things are happening more and more frequently and the use of social media allows us to have a peek into the dysfunction that was their lives.
      How can Shanann claim that her daughter has a deadly allergy to all tree nuts and that she won’t allow them in, or anywhere near her home, go on a rant about her mother in law and the next week she is whipping up batches of pecan butter, peanut butter, chocolate chip thrive bites.
      Take a look at the ingedient list on those pro bars she liked to pass around to her friends, her daughter’s included, and tell me what you see in those bars. There are so many inconsistencies in her statements that I could write a book. (Hehe, not a jab at shakedown, promise)
      Not to mention the fact that they were being sued for $1500.
      Yeah, $1500.00 Not a lot of money if you’re bringing in $80K. Why not pay what you owe. Why? Because they didn’t have the money. That’s why. Let’s talk again when the financials come into evidence okay? 🙂
      You live with all this fuckery 24/7 and see how long it takes you have a full blown mental breakdown.
      Linn, no one here is making her out to be the perp. We just want to understand how this happened to protect the INNOCENT CHILDEN being trapped in the dysfunction.
      Let’s think about the children, Linn.

      Liked by 1 person

      • For one…what you saw is what you got with Shanann, not Facebook fuckery. She was a very happy, smiling, laughing, goofy person 95% of the time. As for CeCe. She’d beg you till you wanted to scream to video her and then she would ignore you. Have kids? Been around any? Can be annoying as hell sometimes. Did she make 80k a year in the MLM business? No, she made almost 200k and they weren’t in debt, so sorry. Just because someone is taking you to court for money and not that much of it, they’re bankrupt? Wrong. How many friend and family interviews did you see when everyone who knew them said, “NO WAY”. In ALL OUR eyes they were the perfect couple. Up until the LAST WEEK. They were always all over each other. Always calling and texting and lived for each other and those kids. Never seen a closer family. How do I know so much about their marriage?… I’ve been best friends with Shanann for 15 years. Met here through a Lupus Program. Became BFFs within an hour of talking and have talked or texted almost 7-365. Then she fell in love with Chris, with a lot of pushing…then so did I. How do I know so much about their money? I also work for them in that whole MLM…THRIVE thing. Neither have paid for a car in years. NOBODY will know why Chris did what he did until that fucking bastard tells us right from his own mouth. Ohhhh…and don’t believe ALL the “other woman” is saying. It’s not all true.

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      • exactly she was an attention grabber at all coast, Chris was her shit rug prop she didn’t have any respect for him just how she could make it appear like what a picture-perfect family they are. Chris didn’t know how bad they were in debit cause he thought she made 80k, when the investigation came out he found out the 80k was actually her draining his 401k and more debit and supposedly the company paid for lots stuff, cause she wouldn’t let him control anything financially that’s how they got into such a mess cause she wanting that life but really didn’t want to help get it to work for it . She and her friends were going to fill the house up with her friends and their kids kick Chris out and take him for his paycheck in alimony and child support and were bragging about it. He knew they were in over their head but he didn’t know the extra whammy that he learned that she really wasn’t making any money as she claimed. People that know her said every time she sees a new disease or an even a commercial talking about an illness her and the kids and it.If she had all these illness and the kids too she could never be doing stuff she was doing, impossible, oh but that was heer sales pitch why thrive was so amazing LOL She was pathetic. Unfortunately it leads to him snapping, he even said he felt like that day he was robotic and mention after he started taking thrive some double black patch he felt his robticnesss then now he is in jail he see it impacted him allot and he feels if he wasn’t taking that he wouldn’t have never snaped like this.


    • Because Chris is already judged and dealt with. It’s a done deal. Now all we’re left with is why. Why and how could something like this happen? Not excuses for what he did or blaming Shannan for causing herself to get killed. But how could a guy in a situation like that snap? You know life doesn’t happen in a vaccuum. Tragadies happen as a result of MANY things that go wrong. To believe otherwise means you believe that he just woke up one day and said, “i think i’ll kill my pefect wife and kids today because I hate my perfect life.” You have a hard time hearing anything negative said about Shannan because you believe that the perfect image she was portraying was legit. It wasn’t. In fact far from it and though nothing she did warranted being murdered, the fact is he did snap for reasons that anyone one of us would probably snap given that same situation. People snap in various different ways and at various levels. If he beat the shit out of her and left without killing her wouldn’t you want to know what factors existed to push him to that point? Would you be satisfied to hear that she was perfect and it was all his fault for beating her? Of course not. Shannan didn’t deserve to get beaten, killed or even treated poorly but that’s not how human relationships work in this world. He fuckin snapped just like any of us would snap in that same situation. It’s just that most of us are smart enough to say snap while still not killing anyone. Just because Shannan got killed by an idiot, doesn’t relieve her from her role in creating a toxic situation for hersel and her children. The story is not, cannot and wil not ever be: “perfect mother and wife gets killed by bad husband suddenly turned monster.” Life is never that simple. It doesn’t excuse his behavior, but it tells the hows and whys of how a seeminlgy perfect family suddenly find themselves dead or in prison for the life..


    • Chris didn’t even have access to the passwords of their online accounts. After Shannan was missing, the police asked him in the televised news if he could check if she had used the accounts. He couldn’t, he did not have access to his accounts. He was given an allowance by Shannan. So controlling. So I think it’s safe to say he wasn’t the overspender heading them to bankruptcy a second time. She posted on Facebook posts that said she was glad Chris was working when her purchases were delivered, joking about it.


  4. This is just a simple thing I noticed right away. Mom and the girls wore very nice clothes. No hand me downs here. Granted she used them as photo props for her “business” but the little shoes and boots and dresses along with her clothing are not something you’d expect from someone that has had serious financial problems. Also how did they buy that house after filing bankruptcy?Getting pregnant again?He didn’t seem too thrilled to me. Lot of stress going on there. What a tragedy.


      • but she sure got her nails done every 2 weeks. Let me tell you something, I am worth
        $200,000 my home and care are paid for… I don’t have artificial nails, and I don’t get manicures and pedicures on a regular basis, and why? because it’s not in my fucking budget…there’s car and house and flood and health insurance, property taxes, perrsonal income taxes,gas, out of pocket medicals, normal upkeep on the house, like maybe I might need a new roof or A/C… but I guarantee damn tee you I am not being sued for lack of payment for anything…U understand me. If I had already filed for bankruptcy and my Home Owner’s Association was sueing me for lack of payment of dues, my nails would not be getting done. And for as far as all of those trips, LE-Vel may have paid for part of the trip but believe me they paid equal the amount out of pocket for expenses incurred on those trips… it was not a free trip by any stretch..Even the police when searching through the house said, ‘I’ve never seen so much stuff’ and it certainly didn’t seem to be consumer consumption by Chris…I really don’t think Chris bought 5 Christmas trees, or had as many pairs of shoes as Emelda Marcos… especially when it was stated by many that all she wore was flip flops buy had a fucking closet of shoes from floor to ceiling. The woman was a damn materialistic flake…

        Liked by 1 person

  5. I am a little frustrated at people blaming Shanann. First of all who is dead? Shanann is! Why would a man murder his whole family? Just because he is lonely and financial stress. BS . He wanted a new life. No kids, no bills . He wanted to be free. Chris was dressed just as nice as her and the girls. How do you know all her clothes are new? You don’t . She could have very easily been shopping at a consignment shop! You can get new and like new! I shop them all the time. People need to quit judging Shanann and blaming her. Do you know what it was like behind closed doors? No you don’t!!! She did not deserve to be murdered and thrown in a shallow grave! That sickens me! Than the poor girls put in crude oil tanks. He is a cold blooded Heartless Murdere! Sociopath, Narcassist and psychopath!

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    • Jean. Shan’ann donated a lot of her kids clothes, it’s across her social media. Never seen any mention of buying clothes at consignment shop though. She also says in her feed that she does the household finances and buys most of his clothes. Those are not judgments, they’re just examples from her own accounts.

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    • I agree. I got gery angry when I read the blogger’s pist. Shanann is not to blame, even if she was careless with money and pretentious.


    • I don’t know you, but, I love you and THANK YOU SO MUCH, for those words you’ve just said about my best friend. Yes, she was cheap. She got the nice cars from working for them. I DO know what it was like behind those closed doors and it’s almost nothing like anyone thinks because of the HORRENDOUS outcome. I loved Chris just as much as I do Shanann but soooooo few people say ANYTHING positive about her. I DON’T understand. Sorry, to throw a rant at you but THANK YOU, again!!! REALLY. Shanannigans would love it!! 💜💚

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      • Laudy, I am so sorry about the loss of your friend and her children! It is nice to see someone that knew her saying these positive things. On Youtube, there are people saying not so nice things, and much of it is supposition. These mean people are commenting on Plunder videos there. Glad to read your words here.


    • I I believe that Shanann was over bearing and that she was a control freak. She did not even let him talk to his parents or let his parents see their grandchildren. Shanann needed to realize that those were his kids also and he had every right to let them see them. And as far as the nut tree thing goes it’s funny how she said that her kids can’t go there no more cause the mother-in-law tried to hurt them with the nuts yet a YouTube video she was baking up some recipe with nuts in it also look at those protein bars what kind of ingredients do you think they have in them. I honestly believe he would have had a chance or a lot more support if he didn’t kill the kids. I think he just built up all the anger. Also Chris said he did not like being in front of the camera and she was always making him do those fake ass videos he even said he did not want a gender reveal party on Facebook live yet she did not care about his feelings it was all about what other people thought.

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      • yes she is fake af…. its gross using her own children in her money scheme..as for her “friends” nauseating they sound as shallow as her..exploiting her for a sale…..


    • Because Chris is already judged and dealt with. It’s a done deal. Now all we’re left with is why. Why and how could something like this happen? Not excuses for what he did or blaming Shannan for causing herself to get killed. But how could a guy in a situation like that snap? You know life doesn’t happen in a vaccuum. Tragadies happen as a result of MANY things that go wrong. To believe otherwise means you believe that he just woke up one day and said, “i think i’ll kill my pefect wife and kids today because I hate my perfect life.” You have a hard time hearing anything negative said about Shannan because you believe that the perfect image she was portraying was legit. It wasn’t. In fact far from it and though nothing she did warranted being murdered, the fact is he did snap for reasons that anyone one of us would probably snap given that same situation. People snap in various different ways and at various levels. If he beat the shit out of her and left without killing her wouldn’t you want to know what factors existed to push him to that point? Would you be satisfied to hear that she was perfect and it was all his fault for beating her? Of course not. Shannan didn’t deserve to get beaten, killed or even treated poorly but that’s not how human relationships work in this world. He fuckin snapped just like any of us would snap in that same situation. It’s just that most of us are smart enough to say snap while still not killing anyone. Just because Shannan got killed by an idiot, doesn’t relieve her from her role in creating a toxic situation for hersel and her children. The story is not, cannot and wil not ever be: “perfect mother and wife gets killed by bad husband suddenly turned monster.” Life is never that simple. It doesn’t excuse his behavior, but it tells the hows and whys of how a seeminlgy perfect family suddenly find themselves dead or in prison for the life..


      • You can go around in circles ’till you’re out of breath but the fact remains that murder is never the answer. No matter what you choose to say about Shannan, you seem to forget he also murdered his two little girls. What did they do to deserve this? He could have walked away BUT he was too selfish to do that, he didn’t want the responsibility of having to pay maintenance for his daughters yet had no qualm in killing them.


      • if u watch her videos u can see the obvious fakey fake…but occasionally too there is a flash of her control freak face….chris was an obediant whipped beta male who lost it…… rip innocent kids


  6. I don’t think we’ll really ever know. Chris fucked up. All he had to do was disappear. But He didn’t want to leave something, or someone, so he made his family disappear. Now he’s in a cell and has disappeared. What a dumb ass. And all this for nothing. I’m thinking Chris might be pretty stupid..

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    • Well I think we will know, and perhaps already do know. Many people still believe the Scott Peterson case is mysterious or unsolved, or that there was no motive. There was. You’re wrong, he didn’t just have to disappear. If he could have he would have. For certain reasons he felt trapped in a nightmare. If we can’t see those reasons it doesn’t mean he was stupid or a monster, nor does it mean Shan’ann was to blame. It simply means we don’t have a handle yet on the family dynamics. One way to start getting a handle is to think about relationships you’ve been in, and what made you feel trapped.


  7. What makes you feel trapped, and how do you deal with it. At first I didn’t understand. Then I did, but I couldn’t relate. I introspected a little more – painful as it was, especially as it pertained to my own MLM experiences and marriage, and then I could relate. I just dealt with it all differently. I noticed that when I get cornered, boxed in, and feel defeated, I disappear. I run. Fight or flight. I flew. Now can you relate? When it gets really bad do you fight for it, or do you run from it. How did Chris Watts deal with his situation – he didn’t leave – in fact I think he was HOPING he could stay in that house and that if were just him he could afford it, maybe even pay off the home owner’s association. He felt his way out was to get rid of the three people (and future little person) who were taking it all away, draining him dry, bankrupting him emotionally and financially.


  8. I agree with the person who said think about what made you feel trapped in relationships you’ve been in. Something I don’t think I’ve seen mentioned in any of the comments I’ve seen about this case is the possibility Chris never wanted kids. Not that this is an excuse to do something horrible. But I think it’s highly likely that what made him want to marry her in the first place was that she told him she COULDN’T GET PREGNANT because of lupus. This literally happened to me minus the lupus part. The father made my life a living hell throughout the pregnancy and demanded an abortion over and over and over again even in the late months. Obviously this isn’t how Chris reacted but maybe that’s because he was already MARRIED to her and had to play along because that’s kind of what’s expected when you’re married(to have kids and be happy about it even when you expected your wife to “not be able to have children” like she told you). Then all the sudden he’s about to be a father of THREE and drowning in debt and has a girlfriend on the side. If people were more honest sharing kids in itself is a HUGE reason for people to feel TRAPPED. I myself constantly think about how if I leave, I’ll still be tied to the father and he’ll be able to legally harass me through the court system regarding the sharing of the child for years to come(and control me through the child as much as humanly possible as a way of getting back at me). In a sense you leave but you never really get away from the person. You still aren’t free. If people were honest the thought of separating and still having to deal with the person who can make your life hell in so many ways for years to come is enough to make anyone feel insane. Obviously most people just suffer through it because you have to deal with it, but some people apparently think they can get away with murder. The idea of you being single and getting a portion of their hard earned paycheck makes them sick. Watch forensic files, happens all the time. Just common sense.

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    • Excellent point and observation. I had a friend who was similarly led to believe his wife couldn’t have children, and so when she fell pregnant it was a catastrophe. It took years to recover from and I’m not sure they ever did. The firstborn was also a terror of a child, which made a difficult situation that’s much more difficult. Maybe his wife was also genuinely mistaken about whether she could fall pregnant, or she was naive or…?

      I have suggested that the third child may not have been “part of the plan”, not Chris’ anyway, but very much part of Shan’ann’s.

      It’s an interesting conjecture that none of the children were wanted by the father. It’s possible. I find it a slight stretch to think that would be the case with Celeste – if there was one child, why couldn’t there be another? On the other hand Celeste was conceived slap bang in the middle of their first bankruptcy issues. Was Celeste a dry run then – a ploy to keep Chris around?

      Also, there are many instances of Chris playing with the kids, and he appears to be enjoying himself. Maybe he is, maybe he isn’t. We saw he appeared to enjoy being a husband and being married – it didn’t mean he did. The more pertinent question [for me] isn’t whether he wanted kids or not, but if he didn’t want children, why not?


      • Shanann said on video and to her friends that Chris wanted another child and she was unsure, stated later that Chris gave her the courage for a third in one of her glowing speeches about him. Takes it back to his presentation before he married shanann that a child can sometimes repair a marriage. Not sure why people always insinuate if there is a pregnancy in a troubled marriage the wife got pregnant on purpose to hold the man.


  9. I’m reading about everything happening, really is something very sad, nobody deserves to die, not matter the circumstances, I have learned that a beautiful house, the best cars, clothes, the most beautiful photos and videos on social networks does NOT define that you have a perfect life or perfect family. A marriage is two, in good and bad times don’t care who does more, Nobody is perfect, just one try to do the right things for the family, so always I’m thinking if she had a divorce in mind, why did she entrust her daughters to someone she not longer trusted? My first impression was, my daughters are where I’m, now he is a sycophant, narcissistic, sick person but I’m woman, we don’t have a sixth sense to detect bad things, we have 10 or more open sense to realize that something is not working well, what was more important to be a success or my daughters? Something was wrong in this relationship, maybe this a reason I don’t use the social network because people smile when they are really crying, she post in fb saying “ my husband is my rock man” unfortunately she did not know him, sadly now they are successful tragedy , I’m sorry if I’m wrong but they are my feelings and still I’m praying for both families !

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  10. Well I have no idea why Chris didn’t want kids (assuming that was the case). In my case I was told mine didn’t want kids because there are a lot of things wrong with him (the father) that he didn’t want to pass on or think it was right for someone like him to be a father. Also, that this world is a horrible place and it’s not right to bring innocent kids into such a horrible place. That and the responsibility of having to pay for and protect them. Just random thoughts here.


  11. One thing for sure you hit the MLM on the head man ! Do you realize the dinero she would have lost if he left her? Le-Vel has a divorce clause in the contract . I kid you not ! Plus do you think he really had time to be VIP car status while working in the fields ? Ha my bet she sold under his name and would lose her a@@ on her pay qualifications . I just wonder whose names on those Lexus cars they got on lease. With the bankruptcy by them in 2015 seems hard to get a lease and her parents filed that same year ! Looks like the parents even lived there with them according to the address.


    • Of course it pales in comparison. That doesn’t mean it’s irrelevant. Just as relevant is what Shan’ann – who knew him best – hated about him. Any ideas?


      • I think Shanann mentioned that Chris “didn’t have game” in reference to a discussion she had with a friend regarding the possibility that Chris was having an affair. So what does “not having game” mean from Shanann’s viewpoint? I think it means disappointment and eventually anger in his not being able to deliver the lifestyle she felt she and the children deserved: big home, big SUV, big spending account, and ultimately a sense of security. I suspect these feelings of resentment toward Chris mounted as the MLM mythology failed to deliver its promise of wealth, thereby imposing more focus, pressure, and aspersions on Chris, who had a relatively secure but blue collar job. I don’t think it’s any accident that as Shanann’s regard for Chris shrunk, his muscles grew larger and more defined. What he couldn’t accomplish via behaving and providing like a man—in part due to his inherent introversion— he compensated for in at least looking more like a man via an embellished physical stature. That he sought further refuge from his circumstances and himself through an extramarital affair is no surprise, since the initial stages of ardor and idealization enable a self-fantasy with which the daily business of marriage and children can’t compete.


    • It has enough to do with Shannan to qualify as relevant. How can a woman be so SELF CENTERED to not know, or care, that her partner does not want kids, yet gets pregnant 3 x? She had responsibility of dragging almost 3 innocents into a miserable life that had it culminated in divorce, would’ve left them without a father?


  12. In the communication video of Chris, he states that sometimes having a child can mend a relationship. Shannan in her magical thinking took that message seriously by becoming pregnant for the third time.

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  13. Well, I agree with everything I’ve read so far, but I’ll like to go farther with Chris’ thinking. So he’s feeling trapped and can’t get out of his nightmare. Why did he choose murder? He is worse off now than he was. I know Two Face points to greed, but was murder his only option?


    • For him it was. He thought it was. TWO FACE II goes into a lot more detail in this regard, and one starts to see how and why he felt locked-in in several respects.


  14. Chris may have been in existential crisis like in the song Once in a Lifetime by Talking Heads:

    And you may find yourself
    Behind the wheel of a large automobile
    And you may find yourself in a beautiful house
    With a beautiful wife
    And you may ask yourself, well
    How did I get here?

    And you may ask yourself
    How do I work this?
    And you may ask yourself
    Where is that large automobile?
    And you may tell yourself
    This is not my beautiful house!
    And you may tell yourself
    This is not my beautiful wife!
    Letting the days go by, let the water hold me down
    Letting the…

    I’ve watched a lot of Shan’ann videos, and wished I saw her make videos without the need to talk to random strangers as she interacted with her family. Her videos kind of remind me of a Black Mirror episode. There’s an odd coldness about her that I can’t put my finger on. Maybe it’s her OCD that has been already documented by her friend. Nonetheless, I think she is a great mom. By no means did she deserve what happened to her and her beautiful girls. Maybe if Chris communicated his unhappiness to her, they could have worked it out; gone to counseling, maybe started going attending church. QUIT THRIVE. Shan’ann was smart, articulated, and presented herself very well – beautiful lady. I know of so many technology companies who would have hired her in a second to work in sales/social media, probably from home. Companies that were legit – great health/vacation benefits, good steady salary – enough where she would not have to depend on Chris’ salary at all. Bella was going to kindergarten with CeCe not too far behind. She could have worked when they were in school and when she put them down for bed at 6:30.

    She says her kids are sleep trained “I just put them in their beds and they go to sleep. No cuddles, etc.”I was a stay-at-home mom and did attachment parenting with my oldest, mainly because I didn’t know what the hell I was doing. It was just instinctual for me – the breastfeeding, co-sleeping, lots of hugs, kisses, cuddles. My children still want to be held as they fall asleep. We’re working on sleep training now and they are a little older than Bella & CeCe.

    Shan’ann had that Southern “Get Er’ Done” Grit that I admire. She’s definitely Alpha-Female, no question.

    Beautiful souls.


  15. I want to expound on the MLM thing. I have watched a lot of her videos and I suspected that she really did not make a lot of money off Thrive, based on what I know about MLM (superficial) and based on my observation of Shan’ann. She was her own biggest consumer of Thrive. She also gave out a lot of “free” samples to her social media followers. In reality they were not free because she had to pay for them. So not only was she not bringing in income, she was also creating a deficit. Chris made $90,000 a year. Put that against their $400,000 house and tens of thousands in loans. Shan’ann definitely seemed excited about being a salesperson. She seemed so sweet and bubbly, it is shame she is not around anymore.


  16. Being married to an individual that demeans you, belittles you, questions you, ignores you and rages at you when the mood hits him is nothing less than mindfuc*ery. People post here based on conjecture, I can assure you from personal experience, mistreatment of a spouse, albeit verbal, is ABUSE. Experiencing this on a daily basis is TRAUMA. People ask how could Chris be the victim if he had the capacity to place everyone in barrels and bury Shanann, well it is possible. I can tell you, that had I not gotten my mind together to leave my sick, controlling husband, who knows what I could have been capable of. The abused individual becomes a pressure cooker, one can only take so much… one can snap in the worst way.

    I left the marriage 10 years ago and try not to think of the horrendous things he did including forcing our 8 year old son out of the truck in the middle of a dark highway. He then drove off, forcing my child to cross a freeway to find shelter. My ex was OCD, his clothes had to be perfectly ironed and pleated. If I smiled at a stranger or said hello to another male, i was hounded about it for hours and then he would continue to bring it up weeks later. I would find new computers, new cars, new televisions, etc when I came home from work…he always had to have a bigger/better model, and he never asked for my opinion on anything before buying it. I hated that.

    Narcissists are not right in the head and are highly insecure… the snarky remarks Shanann made on the videos were a small glimpse of the goings on behind closed doors. Chris did not strike me as a narcissist, he does however have very similar traits to that of a person with high functioning autism, ie Asberger’s— they are very black and white, are awkward socially, and for the most part introverted. I have a child with this condition and Chris reminds me very much of him. I have seen just about every video of the Watts that is out there. Shanann was a bully, she was insecure and materialistic. That is a fact. She made a point of mentioning her LEXUS, her new Black Stainless Steel fridge, her Alexa, and also fidgeted / drew attention to all of her gadgets – watch, bluetooth, monitor, state of the art humidifier, countless vacations. I don’t like bullies and I don’t like shallow people, she would never have been a friend of mine, I would have seen through all that fake crap, including those creepy nails, zero humility. It is a tragedy that it ended this way, unfortunately she was a huge part of the problem and pushed him over the edge.

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    • I think Shanann is being gas lighted, as Chris was an overweight socially awkward man who probably needed a more positive outlook and go getting woman. Going bankrupt in the past can be a relief as debts are wiped out, and they can start again. Shanann could probably see her husband had something wrong with him, but if she kept saying how great the marriage was and how the kids loved him, she might have thought it could him to know he was valued


    • Study up on Covert Narcissist- Chris appears to exhibit many, if not all, of the textbook traits. He was hooking up with sexual partners via online websites even prior to the NK mistress came into the picture (both female AND male lover hookups, this is not an opinion yet a fact)… Covert Narcissism is a formed personality disorder from childhood. They most often marry to give the appearance of being ‘normal’ or in other words, only a pretense of caring, for the sake of appearing normal. They need the woman/wife to validate them as normal to the world. Even if it’s not real matters not as long as it appears real to the world. They spend a lot of mental effort and energy on protecting and isolating themselves from exposure well in advance of any potential exposure they might face later on down the road. They are egosyntonic- meaning to the behaviors, values, and feelings that are in harmony with or acceptable to the needs and goals of the ego, or consistent with one’s ideal self-image. A Coverts primary trait is to love bomb, devalue and discard.

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    • R apodac you took the words right out of my mouth!!! I truely believe he was being bullied by Shanann. Her videos were all about image. He looked as though he was more of a servant and then a husband. And if you noticed she did not even care about his feelings he said and the prisoner of you that he did not want a gender reveal party because he did not want to do it live on FaceTime he wanted to be private and of course she had to do the gender reveal party because it’s the in thing now on Facebook. If she truly cared about his feelings I feel that she would’ve considered he did not want to do that I know she postponed it but you know damn well she was going to have their gender reveal party with or without him. I also agree with you I do not think chris was a narcissist at all! A narcissist is usually an extrovert and as we all know chris was an introvert, a narcissist usually is materialistic and likes to brag and be the center of attention chris hated being on those videos he also says he likes to just go with the flow there are many other reasons why I don’t believe he is a narcissist another thing is narcissist so rarely killers. It honestly seems like most people on social media the first thing they say is he’s a narcissist just because they want to sound like they are a detective. They don’t have a clue about any of the stuff they are all looking at it with emotion and not logic. I am so glad I found this website because I feel like there are people that actually understand and I especially agree with everything you said .

      Liked by 1 person

      • I agree with all that you and R apodaca have said. Actually, I only found this site after searching for something, anything, someone, anyone that see’s the Watts case as I do. I also do not think CW is a narcissist. On the contrary, I perceive SW as narcissistic. In the Feb. 2019 interview, CW said he went camping w/ NK and that he had always wanted to go camping but never got to. (Imagine princess SW pooing in the woods and sleeping in a tent!) He also loved NASCAR, Ford Mustangs and all things race car, yet, SW was cruelly and neglectfully uncompromising…so much so, that year after year he served solely as a personal assistant to her needs, and wanted desires. With NK, he finally felt what those faulty Thrive patches had promised him. Sadly, CW doesn’t appear to have a fully developed, cognitive capacity to unravel his personal problems independently. I think he was working off of a feeble, insecure delayed maturity and that is what precipitated his grossly negligent, murderous behavior. It’s not like he had anyone to talk to about what he was experiencing. Even IF he was ever allowed to talk about something other than what SW wanted or needed, he had nobody to discuss his troubles with. Once awakened, he must have recognized he was incredibly trapped then scared because he saw no escape from his slave status to SWs desires. Further considering that she reprimanded him for minuscule things, the thought of enduring a life of verbal attacks that divorce and visitation would allow for must have brought about unbearable fear on him, as he lacked any confidence and the emotional intelligence necessary to recognize the interpersonal disconnect that comes with time after a divorce. Thus, he undoubtedly concluded that he could continue to live feeling dead or he could make them dead and finally live.


      • I am not condoning violence on any form. What that man did was horrible and he’s paying for it now. He lied over and over, made up stories. Also, the two little girls didn’t have to be murdered by their father no less in such horrible manner. What he did has no forgiveness not even from Christ. He calculated and planned, it seems what he ended up doing. We are no one to judge his emotional reactions or lack of it, every person is different obviously.
        But from I’ve read about the character of the murdered woman is that a person so obnoxious as she was and so demeaning towards the husband, it was a matter of time until he left her doing her little social media videos alone. It’s tragic he decided to kill her and the girls instead and put those families, both families through such pain. Let’s hope that from all this both men and women that may be going through silent abuse learn from this tragedy and gather strength and say I’ll take it no more, I’ll walk away from any kind of abuse and violence. So we pray.


    • YES YES YES to all of this, I was raised by a mean, biting, sarcastic mother. The damage to our psyches as kids is almost something one can’t come back from. I saw her (Shan’ann’s) mean digs at Chris, even subtly calling into question, his very manhood to a very public and wide audience. A man can only take so much.
      No way does that justify the murders; I would never say that. But I think he was ill-equipped to deal with manipulation and subtle insults and slowly, over time “lost it”. My anger with Chris lies in that he should have sought counseling/therapy (instead of refusing to “sit on a stranger’s couch and talk”—- and divorced her. Murder is not something that enters into people’ minds easily, unless they are very sick. And he was/is. What a tragedy. None of this had to happen. She controlled him under a tight fist, I believe it. The damage was done. The consequences unbearable; those innocent kids! Her family! NONE of this should ever have HAPPENED! I don’t feel sorry for the murderer. I reserve that for the victims. But I see clearly what she did to him in a very public and humiliating way. A book could never fix the damage. They needed serious counseling. Too late. Too horrific. Too sad.


    • You should have left,Chris,and not looked back,kids would still be here,wife albeit,exwife,aswell,and you wouldn’t be where you are now.The only thing to come out of this is that anyone going through the same thing,should just leave,and don’t let it become a tragedy,unfortunately,like this.


  17. I think that her being away for 6 weeks, only made matters worse. Chris had a lot of alone time (the house was calm and silent im sure) then on top of it, he had time to see everyone and anyone he was having an affair with. I think she was total A personality and super bossy (you can tell by some of the videos and also some people that knew them both also mentioned that) Yes, this doesn’t give him the right to kill her and the kids, but he slowly but surely snapped. He snapped in his mind for months. I think he decided to move the bodies because he was hoping to not get caught. He probably thought the girls would not ever be found. In the end they had major debt, were about to loose their home, and all of that thrive selling bs was a way for Shanann to make money. They clearly were living beyond their means. In his mind he probably thought it was cheaper to kill her and the kids. vs divorcing her and paying spousal support and child support. They needed help a long time ago. The signs were there. Both failed to get the help they both needed with all the issues they had financially, emotionally, etc. etc. The worst outcome happened.


  18. After hearing both sets of families speak, Shanann’s seem the most level headed and normal. Her brother spoke of how he thought he had a brother-in-law who his nieces trusted.
    I can’t help wondering if the propaganda on the internet trying to blame Shanann for Chris doing that to her and the children were from his family, as when I heard his mother talk, she seemed to care more about blaming Shanann for what her son did, than she cared about what her son did to her daughter-in-law and grandchildren


  19. I think the videos from Shanann were a desperate attempt to cover the feelings she had that her husband wasn’t the normal husband she wished for. If she kept saying how everything is perfect and children say how much they loved him, it might become a reality.
    She seemed to be the bright spark in the relationship. He was overweight and socially awkward before she started getting into nutritional supplements, which she worked hard at for a home based business.
    I don’t think he told Shanann he wanted a divorce, as he was seeing another woman and telling her he was already getting divorced.


  20. I think everything was building up in this marriage. Over a relatively small time frame.
    Chris being alone, enjoying his *new freedom”….he started to really think of his situation.
    The money, house, credit cards, payments being taken to court. He says Shanann handled the finances….what about the Mail, were some bills being hidden from him.
    Third baby, he didn’t want, more debt.
    The ways of his marriage. Him being controlled all the time…Shanann says I’m giving you space…was this before she went away…or while she away?
    I don’t believe you just fall out of Love, it takes time…his alone time did neither any good. I think after 3rd announcement, he realized ….this is not good.
    They could have had a nice smaller home, smaller payments, maybe had 3rd baby and might have been ok.
    The stress factor for him was to great.
    Whether he thought he could continue with this girl…a Total Liar she is…or go out alone.
    No mention of him having any girlfriends before Shanann. She could have been his longest sex partner and gf.
    He was sowing his oats.
    Maybe no pressure.
    Feeling free.


  21. I have been reading this horrendous case since the beginning also, as many of you have. This case hits home I believe because they were in many ways a normal family. We all have had relationships that have had or do have many of the same problems. Relationships are very hard sometimes. Both people can get complacent in them. It is a lot of hard work to stay married. The stresses of time, money, kids, sex, house cleaning, bills, how we decide to spend money, how we raise our children, how we get along with the in-laws, holidays, values and Morales are all huge factors.
    This is what I thought, I did not think that s hanann was really hearing what Chris said in many videos, she was more focused on what she wanted to say. She did not include her husband and she did not truly hear what he wasn’t saying. He was an introvert. She an extrovert. Instead of her sending him a book while she was away it would have been better if she asked him if they both could read one and go over it together to me it was almost as though it offended him. In the discovery it had said he discarded the book. In no way shape or form do I condone any of what he did. I also believe that he was very very selfish in the end of their relationship. I also believe that he truly did not understand as many men don’t how to communicate very well as well as we women seriously need to understand and figure out our husbands. Nobody stays the same. We all like to grow and we all like to evolve and change. I personally wish they both had known the Lord and had both been born again. I know this would not have happened if they had a higher power other than themselves. I did hear shannan mention God a few times but it wasn’t a deep personal relationship with Jesus Christ. So I myself being a born again Christian go off of what I have learned since knowing the Lord. And I do know in Genesis it was within the first few chapters that Cain killed Abel. I mean the first murder happened with the first two children born on the planet after Adam and Eve. So by saying what I know to be true in the Bible there were many many many murders. And of course that was not God’s original plan. But because of the sin in the world it happens. I can only say that it’s been very tragic for their families. Chris Watts his life is completely over. What he has left will be in prison for the rest of his life. He will be different forever. After he killed his family he looked so dark his eyes just looked so dark. I also think that his complete love for Metallica music did not help. The music that he likes to listen to is very dark. I also believe that when Shannon announced they were having a third child that was the breaking point for him. I think had she not gotten pregnant for the third time this would not have happened this way but I could be very wrong. This is my opinion. “Oh what a tangled web we weave with those we do deceive” this case has hit me like no other case. I think it’s because of how normal her life seemed to all of us, it was also the video she made they were very personal good videos and it really was relatable to a woman who was very very into her job and her kids. I think if she had put her husband first that would have been a game changer. Under no circumstances does it give him the right to kill his family he was completely utterly wrong. There was one video where they were at the airport, and she asked him a question and he was about to answer and she cut him off I watch that one about three times and I could see the hurt in his eyes when she cut him off. That was a very telling video to me. It just did not seem like he was really important to her in any of her videos. That still does not give him the right to do what he did but it does show a disconnect in their relationship. I know for me my husband would never want me to put him in videos like that. I know it would drive him crazy. I just wish they could have worked it out and it didn’t come to this. On the one hand I am glad that the girls and Mom are together because it would been very hard for the girls to live without their mom for the rest of their lives. It would have been extremely hard for Shannon to live without her girls. It should have never happened. He should have just gotten a divorce if he was that miserable. It would be very very good if he would explain his thinking during what he did that would give us complete closure although we would never understand his answer I am certain of that.


  22. Whether or not you get seriously pissed off with someone, it can NEVER justify taking the lives of two innocent children nor the person with whom you are pissed off. Nothing – absolutely nothing – can justify what he did. Trying to understand his emotional mind-set is pointless: he was completely devoid of any remorse or emotion subsequent to murdering his entire family. This is a man who made a chilling decision to remove his family from his life, so that he could pursue his burgeoning relationship with his mistress.


  23. Shanann can be partially blamed, but not because if her domineering-ish personality. She can be blamed because she knew he was not a good man, but she stayed with him and had multiple babies with him knowing he was not a good man.

    Malignant narcissists can put on an act for outsiders, but at home they can make things hell for their family. It’s possible that Shanaan was so orderly because Chris demanded it.

    Everyone said Chris was a great guy who was quiet and not violent…but the neighbor mentioned screaming matches between the Watts…and we all know now that Chris is a very violent man.

    Narcissists are very bad with their finances. They want to put on a good show. They cannot “love” anyone. They see their family as mere objects, not humans. They don’t have very long lasting relationships. They are completely self centered. They lack empathy. They get enjoyment out of being the focus of attention.

    Shanaan had to take over the finances because Chris was bad with finances (like Chris mentioned). It could be that Chris encouraged Shanaan to post so much of him or about him on social media. It could be that Chris was emotionally abusing Shanaan throughout the marriage (as narcissists normally do).

    When Chris found his latest narcissist supply (Nikki), it was time to drop kick his family out of the picture.

    I assure you…Shanaan saw red flags when they dated….she saw red flags after they were married…but she made excuses as to why she should stay instead of leaving and brought 3 kids into that mess.

    It seems like most if you are looking at Chris and his thought patterns in why he did this as though he was a normal person. He isn’t normal. He is a psychopath.

    Bottom line…because he’s a narcissist psychopath…it wouldn’t have mattered to him what Shanaan did or didn’t do…he enjoyed her for a while…and when he was done enjoying her he snuffed her and the kids out…so he could move to his next victim.


    • Narcissists are not necessarily usually extroverts, there is also the in-secure Narcissist.
      Chris Watts is a Psychopath, he has no feelings, consideration for another’s life. He murdered two little girls and his unborn son as well as his young wife.
      Shan’ann whatever people decide she was, she certainly was not a murderer.
      People say that maybe he was pushed to killing Shan’ann, no one pushes us to do anything; that’s a cop out. It is we ourselves who decide to do something. Did his sweet dear little children push him to kill them too? No, Chris Watts had no feelings for them, he is a selfish disgusting human being.
      Remember he murdered one of them whilst the other watched.
      He lied to his wife, he lied to police, he was a coward.
      A killer, a liar and a cheat.
      Who decided to take the lives of 4 people. A mass murderer.


    • I don’t believe Chris is a narcissist at all. Narcissists are typically extroverted. Chris is introverted and is a quite type of person. Everyone always jumps to the conclusion that its always a narcissist. However Shannon does definitely come across as a narcissist.

      She was the controlling one. She was the one who objectified her family in all those videos. She was the one who bullied, bossed and humiliated Chris.

      From day one she took control of the finances that led them to bankruptcy. Chris didn’t even have the pass code for their joint account.

      Apparently Shannon had OCD. It was her who kept the house so ordered. Chris didn’t order her to order the house. He didn’t order anything. He was always under her orders and had no voice.

      But I can’t ever understand what happened. Tell me please how anyone could kill their own sweet innocent babies. I just don’t understand.


      • I used to think that, assumed that. Family annihilators have a collection of personality traits and he has none of them, although his situation does (demanding wife, debt).
        Then I watched his interviews from WI jail by CBI, FBI and police. He is not a psychopath. He is a confused sad guy. The more I hear about him growing up, few friends, withdrawn quiet, his IQ test came back 135-140 which is pretty high and incongruent with his communication skills. I think the guy is on the high end of ASD, and lost it due to stress, sensory overload. He is not the typical monster family annihilator.


  24. It is never a suggestion by critical thinkers that Shannan deserved her fate. The human condition and all its complexity is very rarely black and white in it’s outcomes. Neither Chris or Shannon played a singular role in the epic drama that became their lives. In this each were both victim and perpetrator in their own way. It fathoms me that people accuse those who call out the obvious reasons that Chris became tired and frustrated with the lifestyle she purported to others, as Chris lovers and Shannan haters. I myself am neither. MLM and media bragging are the backdrop to this. Chris obviously was a go along to get along. Narcissistic behaviour traits are shown in both Shannan overtly and Chris convertly. However despite the outcome I do not feel that either where narcissistic totally, they were the result of the sum of those parts. Had they both not come together with those traits they wouldn’t of been amplified. Factually we can observe this in Shannans first marriage. Her first husband did not have the reserved unconfident personality of CW, conversely he was a lawyer, lawyers are adept at arguing their point. This in no doubt frustrated SW so she withdrew from the relationship as she was unable to dominate him. She then perhaps subconsciously went into the relationship with CW seeking what she did not have with husband No1. Chris obviously fancied her physically and to start with he saw her as someone he could look after, her behaviour when they first met was submissive. She states this was due to physical illness, I feel it was mental illness and the multitude of diagnosis were a cover for her insecurity and attention seeking, she also later on, projected this upon her children. Chris made the money to keep them, Shannan wanted more and she wanted to portray wealth at any cost.. It is very clear to me that she was unable to manage her life appropriately. My opinion on why we find this case fascinating is because of its modern nature and the one off reactions of family annulation. It is extremely rare for this to be the end to a marriage, however, marriage endings are not rare, they can be brutal and hurtful. They are not usually murderous.. He has not changed his part since the trial and Shannans murder, he still lives in denial, lies and fakery. The interview with police recently shows how he is still living a lie and is more concerned with the opinions of others. He is emotionally vapid and looks to others for direction and purpose. Shannan being his exact opposite wanted everything her way or the highway, she saw nothing in making others feel inadequate with her constant bragging and posing. She purported herself as many things that she simply was not. Great housekeeper, CW did the bulk of that, great Mom, day care, early bed times, constant napping, reliance on in-laws and friends constantly – along with far too may thrive breaks, shows a different reality if you scratch the surface. Adoring wife, no, this was not true either- her platitudes of how he was her rock and the back garden testimonials telling us how he was the “best thing that has ever happened to me” again more lies and bragging, when in reality she had no time, patience or respect for her husband. Loving daughter, she avoided her mother’s calls -perhaps as she couldn’t dominate her and she was probably being give tough love advice about handling her poor finances, credit card spending in her parents name, wrapping Frank around her little finger. The big house and many gadgets, cars, shoes and clothes – showing a wealthy life that was not what it seemed. Business woman, manipulation over others to join and spend money on “starter packs” does not make you a momtraproneur. Great friend, sorry no evidence of this either, her “friends” are the dupes she sold thrive to, she shoved that stuff to anyone who would listen, her nauseating badly presented videos were evidence of her need for people to do as she says and there seems to be no other conversation other than silly overpowering advice rolled out to you whether you want it or not “goal boards and I am beautiful, I am strong, I am loved etc etc all superficial nonsense. When CW had enough her perhaps felt intense fear of telling her, he wanted to carry on with the lifestyle he had with NK, I think he felt he had to take Shannans life to get it, so he did, I think he thought about telling her it was over and considered her reaction, her decided to kill her in her sleep. He killed those children because they were the package, he did for NK, he put her before everyone, including himself. It is a very sad and totally preventable ending. It is a modern day tale of woe.


  25. I have read all of nvdl’s books and comments. I don’t believe nvdl is objective about Shan’ann. He is so prejudiced against her that he is unable to BE objective. A man who plots and plans the murder of his family is a psychopath. There is nothing Shan’ann could have done to bring herself to the point of deserving a death sentence. And those babies, what was their crime? Forget Shan’ann’s faults, the babies’ faults, there is nothing they did to cause their husband and father to visit the death penalty on Shan’ann, Bella and Celeste. NOTHING.
    He was a weak pathetic man who couldn’t speak up for himself but who could strangle his pregnant wife, incidentally taking his tiny son’s life and then kills his baby girls twice. TWICE! I hope he burns in Hell for what he did. He is useless as a man, a husband and a father. His weakness defines him. I hope he suffers every day for the rest of his life. And burns in Hell for eternity for killing his family.


    • I read that she planned to have her friends and their kids move into their house and kick Chris out. She could then cripple his attemts to move on by sucking more money out of him in child support etc.


    • This is what I keep on seeing, the public wanting to blame the woman that raised “the monster”. Yet, they keep asking, why didn’t anyone say something to Shan’Ann? Why didn’t anyone object to her overspending? Someone saw it all coming at the very beginning and did say something. Chris’ mother saw the financial shitstorm coming from a hundred miles away! You see what happened to her, Shan’Ann punished her the second she objected to Chris spending his life savings on her engagement ring. The ongoing histrionic fights over gluten foods gave her power and control over Chris. She was able to whisk him away without any more interference (or reality check from his parents). I don’t see anything that Chris’ mother actually did to deserve all the hate going toward her? She reacted at the beginning the way she did because the last interaction she had with Shan’Ann was her trying to cut her off forever from her son and granddaughters. Again. She played the keep away game with Chris whenever someone tried to stand up to her. Something else happened the last time, that caused Shan’Ann to have a histrionic fit when another grand child (her nephew) grabbed an icecream and I think it had to do with jealousy. She goes on and on and on about “not eating in front of, a 3-4 year old” something they can’t have. Yet no histrionics when the girls are taken to birthday parties (the Lindstrom’s) where cake is eaten in front of. I feel terrible for Cindy and all the hate that society tries to place on the mother of the murderer. Watching the vid of CECE being born it is clear she loved them dearly. She was asked to babysit for the LeVel Ra Ra trips.


      • Yes I feel very bad for Cindy. She never did this but her son did. In a way his family has also been dealt a lifetime of misery. Imagine having a family member who did someting like this?


    • Genetics has a greater influence over the future personality of an individual.
      Upbringing is only part of the equation and is not the single factor.

      To blame the parents is akin to blaming the parents of a disabled child for the child’s disability.


  26. *Disclaimer: My comments in no way condone or excuse what Chris Watts did to his family.
    There are a lot of things being claimed about Chris and Shan’Ann that are just plain wrong. Chris was not an abusive domineering husband and Shan’Ann was not a saint. I believe the opposite to be true.
    Shan’ann did not use her own money to build the home she occupied when she met Chris. Shan’Ann and her first husband built that home together. Shan’Ann got the home and contents in her divorce settlement. There are questions as to wether or not Shan’Ann was involved in “misappropriation of funds” at her job in N.C. but she sold the house and it’s contents and moved to Colorado when she married Chris. At the age of 28, with an income of about $75,000 a year ( pre tax) Chris agrees to build the perfect house for Shan’Ann. A $400,000, 4 thousand square foot mansion. The mortgage was $2,700 a month. The house was originally in Chris’ name only due to Shan’Ann’s bad credit rating. A little over 2 years after moving into the new house the Watts declare bankruptcy. They keep the house and 2 cars (paid for) and write off over $200,000 in debt including over $20,000 spent on their wedding.
    Shan’Ann tells everyone she has Lupus (but never makes that claim on record) she refers to “health challenges” only. The story is that Shan’Ann’s parents lived with them for 18 months because Shan’Ann’s “health challenges” made her pregnancy with Celeste high risk. I believe her parents offered financial help while living in Colorado not that Shan’Ann was to weak to care for her two children.
    You would not think it but after you declare bankruptcy everyone wants to give you credit! Less than 2 years after declaring bankruptcy the Watts are again in debt and struggling to make the minimum payments. The first cost cutting measure was to sell the 4 wheeler Chris bought. Everyone knows anything with a motor decreases in value the minute it leaves the lot and people will sell the vehicle at a loss just to get out from under the monthly payments. Chris has been called “stupid” for doing exactly that. Shan’Ann didn’t take over the bills and accounts from him, she always controlled the money. Chris worked, Shan’Ann spent.
    When things got really bad and Shan’Ann had to get a job she decides that “multi level marketing” ( pyramid scheme) was the answer. She could stay home with the kids and earn an income. Not.
    99.9% of people who attempt that wind up going bankrupt. Lev-el encourages their associates to “live their best life and thrive!” They tell their people if they show others what a life of fabulous riches they live it will result in more “team mumbers” who want “life the thrive life”. The Lexus that lev-el “provided” was NOT a freebie. In order for lev-el to make the monthly payments on the LEASE the associate must achieve a certain level of revenue for the company otherwise the associate pays the monthly lease. The trips and “vacations” are conventions where the associate pays for travel, room and everything other than the lunch and dinner that is provided at the day long convention.
    By Shan’Ann’s own admission she wants “everything in life to be perfect”. Make that expensive and perfect.
    She chuckles about her OCD but when you look at her home you can tell it’s no joke. If you have never lived with someone who is a “perfectionist” and has OCD like Shan’Ann did it’s like living in constant hell.
    If you leave a water mark on the kitchen counter, a dish in the sink or forget to leave your shoes in the garage you are chastised and accused of being “careless, thoughtless, inconsiderate, selfish, etc.” The tiniest little thing, a wrinkle on their perfect sofa after you sat down completely ruins their day and the verbal trade begins. It truly is a nightmare and is psychologically and verbally abusive to the non OCD partner.
    Imagine you are Chris. You grew up in a home with a domineering mother who emasculated your father. It’s Cindy’s way all the time and to “keep the peace” her mealy mouse of a husband just says “yes dear” and does as he’s told. Chris grew up thinking that’s what marriage is like. Cindy knew her son would be the beta to some alfa female and she knew Shan’Ann was in control of her son right from the start. That’s why Cindy didn’t like Shan’Ann and gave her a hard time from the beginning. Well Shan’Ann was going to be in control from the start and she let Cindy know it. One if the things a control freak will do is alienate you from those they feel are a threat and if that means exaggerating (lying) about an incident or something that was said so be it. “You know how your mother is!”
    So now the family is drowning in debt again. And I have to say that it was not from incompetent doctors failing to diagnose asthma for the girls or from a necessary surgery for Shan’Ann. According to Shan’Ann Chris had excellent insurance with his job.
    I’m pretty sure the debt came from all the the STUFF that you saw in that huge house. For a guy making around 90 grand a year before taxes and considering they had a $2,700.00 a month mortgage how the heck do you manage to acquire all that stuff. And Shan’Ann wasn’t shopping at Kmart either, she had expensive taste. Dooney&Bourke, Coach, did you see that sizable collection in her “purse and shoe closet”?!
    And about that mortgage, they were 3 months behind! Chris had taken $10,000 from his 401k from work to catch up on the mortgage and pay the home owners association the $1,000.00 they owed.
    So Shan’Ann is filming your every move, her cell phone is in your face constantly and you are supposed to help her show the world (Facebook, Twitter, etc.) that with thrive in your life everything is wonderful! “I’m so happy!” “Look at my fabulous life!” Towards the end you can see Chris is having a hard time pretending and he’s barely able to smile. He looks like he wants to puke.
    So here is Chris, working long hours, taking any overtime he can get trying to keep their financial head alive water and one day your wife tells you she signed the kids up for the most extensive nicest day care/pre school in town because she can’t watch the kids and pursue her career with thrive. If she just invests more in thriving then the money will follow! Chris knows they can’t afford it and that the MLM “sales job” is not only not paying off, it will never pay off and it’s actually costing them money.
    And as far as exactly who wanted a third child, Shan’Ann “took fertility medicine” (hormones) to conceive both girls because doctors said she would not conceive naturally due to her “lupus”. I can see Chris agreeing to give it a whirl without fertility drugs, he probably thought she wouldn’t get pregnant, after all the doctors said she couldn’t. Well bingo what do you know? She gets pregnant immediately! It’s a miricle! You know it can’t be attributed to the snake oil stickers from thrive that you see plastered all over her and Chris.
    You can see the apprehension on Chris’s face when she of course positions the camera to broadcast the special moment on the internet.
    Chris is not happy at home, he feels like a monkey in a cage due to Shan’Ann’s constant thrive broadcasting, nothing in their life is off limits. He can’t relax in his own home because Shan’Ann’s OCD causes extreme tension. He’s working a lot to try earn enough money to pay the bills and counter the expenses they are incurring with Shan’Ann’s “career”. Then, along comes Nickole, the home wrecker. She starts paying a lot of attention to Chris and he loves it. He starts watching what he eats, goes jogging around the neighborhood, works out a lot and loses weight and gets pretty buff. Again, it was NOT the snake oil bandage miricle cure. If those colored stickers actually caused weight loss they wouldn’t be a pyramid scheme.
    Starting an affair is not the answer when you are stressed out and dissatisfied with your marriage but unfortunately that’s what lots of people do.
    Things must have been getting a bit tense at home because Shan’Ann takes the kids for a 6 week vacation to see the family back east. Of course Chris can’t take 6 weeks off work so he stays home. He. Is. Free.
    Jezebel comes on strong and Chris is thrilled to make a break with his reality. Again, not a good thing to do. Shan’Ann is texting and calling and Chris is not responding fast or often enough. Remember, he is also working, not just chatting around with Jezebel. Shan’Ann wants to tell Chris about how his mother tried to feed Cece peanuts, how his mother planted razor blades all over the house for the kids to injure themselves (that’s crazy, somebody has a vivid imagination. Cindy may hate Shan’Ann but I highly doubt she put razor blades all around her house). Anyway Shan’Ann isn’t happy about not getting a response.
    Chris flys out to join the girls for the last week of their vacation.
    He’s acting differently. He is not affectionate and is very cold towards Shan’Ann.
    Jezebel isn’t the only thing bugging Chris. While Shan’Ann was away Chris got the mail, a whole months worth of mail. It included utility bills, credit cards and other credit accounts, many of which were past due or had a missed payment. Then there’s the law suit filed by the Home Owners Association and the letter from the mortgage company that since they are 3 months behind in the mortgage they are headed for foreclosure.
    What the heck happened to the $10,000.00 from his 401k?!
    He’s distracted.
    Jezebel tells the police: “well like I told him that like he needs to like work on his marriage and like I don’t want to like be responsible for like breaking up a family” but the entire time Chris is with his family that skank is sending him nudes. Ick.
    When they return home from vacation Shan’Ann leaves for one of her many “conferences” with her “job”.
    (I’ve seen these motivational conferences and they are bizarre. Speaker after speaker telling the crowd about their fabulous extravagant lifestyle. They sell motivational books, cd’s and have pamphlets filled with smiling associates getting out of their Porsche or buying another diamond bracelet).
    At some point in the credit card juggling Shan’Ann puts a couple apps on her phone so she can monitor exactly what the balance is on the credit card she can still use. You send them the $300 payment and you will have about$160 available to spend.
    Well Chris is trying to show Jezebel a good time and he either forgot to replenish the prepaid Visa card he had been using or he mistakenly used the regular Visa. Shan’Ann gets a notice from her app that a charge of $62.47 was added to her card. She’s probably angry that Chris used some of the money that she needed
    to get lunch and dinner while on her trip. Her friend said that Shan’Ann “didn’t feel well and wasn’t eating much.. and we never left the hotel room the whole trip”
    According to her friend Nicole that “high amount” spent by Chris caused Shan’Ann to deduce Chris was having an affair.
    The fight back to Colorado was delayed and Shan’Ann got home around 2 a.m. at 2:30 a.m. she attempted to charge $20.00 worth of hair products and her card was declined.
    No one knows how it started, but the was an argument and I believe Chris snapped. He told detectives he was aware of what he was doing but it was like some other force was in charge “I snapped”.
    I do not believe it was premeditated, he obviously didn’t have a plan. I don’t think he would have killed his daughters had Bella not heard the argument and commotion and walked into the room. She was 4, she could have very clearly told about what she had seen.
    Chris put his dead wife in the car and he took his daughters alive (you can see under the truck a small shadow of a child walking out of the garage and see a shadow from the right pick up the child to put her in the truck) and he drove off to the oil battery sight trying the whole drive to n figure out what to do.
    Some doubt his version of killing the girls at the work site but unfortunately I believe that is what it did.
    This was such a horrible tragic story of, despite Shan’Ann’s broadcasts of a happy perfect home, it was an unhappy dysfunctional mess.


  27. Read Shan’ann’s ‘no exceptions’ bedtime routine for her girls. Her MIL makes reference to this list in the book. What caught my eye was ‘tylenol.’ She was giving her kids Tylenol every night before bed at 7 pm. I bet it was pm Tylenol. She was Drugging her kids to sleep. No one should be chronically giving a 3 and 4 year old Tylenol.

    Then I watched his jail interviews on youtube. My view of this has changed entirely. I think he strangled her in her sleep (no defensive wounds) because he just couldn’t take any more of her volatile controlling behavior. I think he knew getting out was going to be a screaming, recrimination festival of all of his faults and he just couldn’t take any more of her.


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